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Classleads (April 2014)

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  • LeikaraLeikara Member Posts: 66 ✭✭✭
    Yaaaay!
  • GabrielGabriel Member Posts: 89 ✭✭
    edited May 2014
    Iluv said:
    Khizan has a classlead for branch that should hopefully cover everything (from bandages to can't burrow above)
    Party is over.  :-S
    image
  • KalcerKalcer Member Posts: 17
    Didn't think of this until just now but could Seraph Fortify function similar to Demon Fortify?


    Syntax: SERAPH FORTIFY
    Using this ability, you may replenish your seraph's power at a cost of some of
    your health.


    SYNTAX:
       DEMON FORTIFY [1 - 50]
    With this ability, you may replenish the health of your loving Ouroboros with your own. It will take percentage of your current health and transfer it to your Ouroboros. If you do not specify a percentage, it will default to 10%.
  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Report #87
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Submitted by: Robb           Status      : Rejected                 
    Skillset    : Predation      Skillname   : Flingdarts
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Problem:
    Flingdarts seems mostly like a filler skill to introduce darts to predators not deep enough in predation for twinshot.  
    Given that its not a very well used skill, I think it should be incorporated into COMBO.  Essentially it gives us the 
    option to sacrifice some damage for the sake of an extra poison.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Solution #1:
    Enable FlingDarts to be used once per combo (ex: COMBO lowhook left flingdart aconite lowhook left <target> <toxin>)
    Solution #2:
    Enable FlingDarts to be used with Combo, but prevent the use of sitara specific toxins to be used in any combo including 
    FlingDarts
    Solution #3:
    Enable FlingDarts to be used with Combo at an increased balance cost, but prevent the use of sitara specific toxins to be 
    used in any combo including FlingDarts
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Decision:
    Not really interested in allowing dual toxin attacks with sitara combos
    Goddamnit. :D
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • KhizanKhizan Member Posts: 2,648 ✭✭✭✭✭
    That one never had a chance of getting through, I don't know why you got your hopes up.

    "On the battlefield I am a god. I love war. The steel, the smell, the corpses. I wish there were more. On the first day I drove the Northmen back alone at the ford. Alone! On the second I carried the bridge! Me! Yesterday I climbed the Heroes! I love war! I… I wish it wasn’t over."

  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Oh I knew it wouldn't go through :D just hilarious to think about the Imperian that would be if it did. Just like a lot of Ferriter's and Camaris' classleads. :D
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • AzefelAzefel Member Posts: 730 ✭✭✭✭
    pfft, if a predator wanted to aff they'd just twinshot you to death anyway :(
  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2014
    but when was the last time you saw one use twinshot effectively? :D

    E: Also, there're a whole lot of classleads where Garryn essentially agrees that there's a problem, but can't approve it because only 1 solution is provided. People should put more thought into designing their Solution #1, #2 and #3. >:[
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • IluvIluv Member Posts: 703 ✭✭✭✭
    Iniar said:
    E: Also, there're a whole lot of classleads where Garryn essentially agrees that there's a problem, but can't approve it because only 1 solution is provided. People should put more thought into designing their Solution #1, #2 and #3. >:[
    At the same time, if I think of one really good solution for a problem after thinking about two really bad solutions for the problem, I don't want to risk Garryn taking the bad ones.
  • AhkanAhkan Member Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2014
    Iniar said:
    but when was the last time you saw one use twinshot effectively? :D

    E: Also, there're a whole lot of classleads where Garryn essentially agrees that there's a problem, but can't approve it because only 1 solution is provided. People should put more thought into designing their Solution #1, #2 and #3. >:[
    We don't get paid to design new skills or address class balance :D
  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Regardless, if people really want change, they have to remember it's really easy for Garryn to say 'No' to one bad idea than 'No' to three middling ones. If it's a good idea and a good solution, yeah, just one would do. If you have to explain your solution with more than two lines, you'll probably need a back up. And what you're really trying to gain is the buy in into the beta where you can whine at Garryn a lot :D:D:D
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • AhkanAhkan Member Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Honestly, in my experience, there is no rhyme or reason to rejection/approval/implementation. It's a pretty terrible decision to say, "This is a problem, but I don't like any of these." Considering the manner in which he handle the beta, there's ample opportunity to go into it with a list of fixes and a formal list of five to six unresolved problems to address. It would not be the first time we did something like this. Instead, we'll blanket reject them out of :effort: and then open up an informal discussion forum so that you can back end blitz something you couldn't push through formally.

    Also, I don't get paid to manage the classlead beta :D
  • SyrukhSyrukh Member Posts: 11
    edited May 2014
    While this thread has been somewhat dead for the last few days, I'd like to bring up something from Iniar's parry report and how the administration will be handling limb damage in the future. Regardless of how you handle it, please do not (for the love of all that is holy) implement pre-restoration in your game. I understand that time-bomb limb offenses are awful but pre-restoration has been the bane of Aetolia for quite a few years now and it has made limb classes pretty much irrelevant. Even when old Infernals were around, it was largely impossible for them to stick a Vivisection on anyone who knew what they were doing and had any semblance of curing. While I realize that would not necessarily be the case here due to venoms that slow down curing balances, Infernal wasn't the only class affected. Aetolia's Monks have also spent a long time being useless in that anyone using them has mostly relied on the cheese factor of how well they scale with artifacts and they've recently toned even those aspects down. The problem largely exists in that it's nearly impossible to balance around pre-restore and Aetolia hasn't been able to do it since the concept's creation about... what, 6 years ago?

    I'm aware that Imperian will likely go in another step, but I'm just posting some extreme caution against pre-restore and I say that as someone who has fought extensively in Aetolia for a few years with one of those classes being a limb class that actually CAN counter pre-restore but it's largely because Lycanthropes do instant level 1 breaks with hamstring/rends and then mangle using bites so pre-restore is largely irrelevant save being used as a way for the Lycanthrope to start mangling other limbs while the person is off salve-balance from the restoration salve.

    Edit: I can, if requested, post some logs from Aetolia as to why pre-restore is largely impossible for limb classes to beat with anyone that has a good system. The log was just me standing there while a Monk attacked me with Mind Blank and I was still able to counter it with my curing/parry.
  • SarriusSarrius Member, Beta Testers Posts: 1,682 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I imagine healing limb damage with be a decision you make instead of pressing the offense against a shielded Krys- I mean Ranger, Monk, etc.
    <div>Message #2062&nbsp; Sent By: (imperian)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Received On: 1/20/2018/2:59</div><div>"Antioch has filed a bounty against you. Reason: Raiding Antioch and stealing Bina, being a right</div><div>****, and not belonging anywhere near Antioch till he grows up."</div>
  • AhkanAhkan Member Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Pre-restore is not the nightmare you claim it to be. You're sacrificing salve balance to cure something, which allows the person on offense to adapt and attack around it. I vivisected plenty of people in my Aetolian stint because of this.

    Pretty sure they weren't going with pre-restore anyways.

    Problems with limb damage are:
    The time bomb nature of the mechanic
    The impact of the afflictions
    Eery limb class having feint, so having parry doesn't matter at all.
  • WysriasWysrias Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭✭
    Pre-restoration is a facet of Aetolia's combat that differs from ours, and I don't think it's possible to make a direct comparison because their classes have been largely balanced around the concept for some time. It's a different mechanic because it places more choice, both for the defender and attacker, in how to use salve balance in the most useful way without allowing other salve afflictions to be stacked or pushed through.

    Limb classes in general are more difficult to play there, but they're a far cry from obsolete. It's rarer to see monks or zealots because the current culture is oriented towards affliction-driven kills (and newer, momentum-driven mechanics), but Teradrim are largely a limb class and extremely powerful in the right hands.


  • IluvIluv Member Posts: 703 ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2014
    If I didn't read wrong, we're getting a channeled restoration to deal with runners. Not like pre rebounding aura linseed smoking.
  • GarrynGarryn Member, Administrator Posts: 527 admin
    edited May 2014
    Correct. Details may change, but that's the gist of it.
  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Beta? :D<3 Excite
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • IriaenIriaen Member Posts: 114 ✭✭
    I dropped in and read everything but didn't notice anything that addresses the state of the damage game.  In my mind that is the biggest flaw in the system right now, I'm disappointed that it seems to have been unaddressed.  There will be no impetus to get people into regular, strategic 1v1 play again for as long as this slugfest, which caters towards those who have spent the most money, continues.
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • SarriusSarrius Member, Beta Testers Posts: 1,682 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2014
    Defiler damage will receive attention in the beta, I am sure. Summoner damage is probably just fine now and Mage will be thereabouts too I expect. A lot of achievable 'big damage' outside of those three (Wardancer, Druid, Claymore DSL) is easily achievable without money besides tri trans.

    What else is there?
    <div>Message #2062&nbsp; Sent By: (imperian)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Received On: 1/20/2018/2:59</div><div>"Antioch has filed a bounty against you. Reason: Raiding Antioch and stealing Bina, being a right</div><div>****, and not belonging anywhere near Antioch till he grows up."</div>
  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just an idea. Redesigning splinter effects;

    Remove germinate and empower

    Cap splinters at 3

    Create a matrix around splinters to create interactive effects that are situationally optimized.

     

     

    Birch

    Hawthorn

    Elder

     

     

    Increase amplitude

    Increase frequency

    Self %

    Ash

    Health drain

    Larger health drains

    Faster ricks

    Some effect to drained to self

    Apple

    Mana drain

    Larger mana drains

    Faster ticks

    Some mana drained to self

    Beech

    Bleeding

    Larger bleeding ticks

    Makes bleeds tick faster

    Makes bloodtears more effective

    Blackthorn

    Periodic limb damage

    Larger limb damage

    Faster limb damage ticks

    -

    Honeysuckle

    RNG Delay cure effects

    Increased duration of cure delay

    Better RNG for effect

    Small RNG to steal same cure

    Willow

    Weakens attacks

    Increases weakness

    -

    Enhances your attacks with small portion of his/hers

    Mango

    Weakens resistances

    Bigger reduction in resistance

    Weakens more than one resistance

    Enhances your resistance from theirs


    For damage, something like:
    1. Ash
    2. Ash, Hawthorn
    3. Ash, Hawthorn, Beech
    4. Renew Ash, Hawthorn, Beech
    5. Ash, Birch, Beech
    6. Ash, Birch, Hawthorn

    For mana teams, something like:
    1. Apple
    2. Apple, Birch
    3. Apple, Birch, Beech or Apple, Birch, Hawthorn

    For implantation set ups;
    1. Honeysuckle, Birch, Hawthorn

    For defensive play,
    1. Ash
    2. Ash, Elder
    3. Ash, Elder, Willow
    Converting back to offensive play;
    4. Renew Ash, Elder, Willow
    5. Ash, Birch, Willow
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • KhizanKhizan Member Posts: 2,648 ✭✭✭✭✭
    That turns a defiler into a slow debuff bot that can't kill anything.

    "On the battlefield I am a god. I love war. The steel, the smell, the corpses. I wish there were more. On the first day I drove the Northmen back alone at the ford. Alone! On the second I carried the bridge! Me! Yesterday I climbed the Heroes! I love war! I… I wish it wasn’t over."

  • IniarIniar Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes, doing something like this will require a shift in the defiler paradigm, perhaps an increase in speed/dps to shift it away from burst. :unsure: just a thought
    wit beyond measure is a Sidhe's greatest treasure
  • IriaenIriaen Member Posts: 114 ✭✭

    Sarrius said:
    Defiler damage will receive attention in the beta, I am sure. Summoner damage is probably just fine now and Mage will be thereabouts too I expect. A lot of achievable 'big damage' outside of those three (Wardancer, Druid, Claymore DSL) is easily achievable without money besides tri trans. What else is there?
    Since wardancers were the ones killing my like $1,500-ish, level 91 character in one combo, I had them at the top of my list.  Even Defiler was below Wardancer for me.  I thought there was a consensus that these kinds of things were a problem but apparently I was wrong if they're not being changed.
    Drill baby drill because luck is a skill.
  • SeptusSeptus Member, Beta Testers Posts: 781 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Paging @Azefel.

    Those broadswords D:

  • BellentineBellentine Member Posts: 56 ✭✭
    Any idea when the long-mooted changes to Mage will be implemented?

    I know, I feel stupid for asking too.
  • SarriusSarrius Member, Beta Testers Posts: 1,682 ✭✭✭✭✭
    When Garryn puts the beta up, it will be about two months or so from that point.
    <div>Message #2062&nbsp; Sent By: (imperian)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Received On: 1/20/2018/2:59</div><div>"Antioch has filed a bounty against you. Reason: Raiding Antioch and stealing Bina, being a right</div><div>****, and not belonging anywhere near Antioch till he grows up."</div>
  • BellentineBellentine Member Posts: 56 ✭✭
    I'll get my christmas list ready then...
  • AhkanAhkan Member Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You have to remember there's rather extensive updates to mage-bot and defiler, the latter being a huge cluster screw of derp from which there is no escape. Also, that Sarapis dude said Garryn works for IRE, not Imperian. They just released updates to the web client, so I imagine our classleads are just simmering on the back burner (which may be a good thing). I don't think an official schedule has been released, so you can just take whatever claims with a grain of salt. The beta varies based on what is done and the amount of feedback there is. Then you have to remember that people will try to last minute, back door clas sleads they couldn't get or were too scared to file in the actual class lead process.

    Do not envy.

    Anyways, Garryn will throw up a post that says. "I have finishing coding the classlead changes. Message me if you want to join the beta." You should apply to that since you're in the minority of competent mage combatants. I mean, There's a solid chance the beta is going to try to boil down the class into a 1 button alias that does everything because "game is too hard."
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